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  #1  
Old 06-28-2020, 03:17 PM
gillchaser gillchaser is online now
 
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Default Changing shooting styles for longer shots

I noticed something today while shooting three fingers only with a bow tuned zero tiller for three under shooting off the shelf .
Pretty accurate out to around 20 yards , but past that I’m having to gap .
While shooting around my backyard range this afternoon, I shot low using three under at a target I’m guessing was around 28-30 yards . Gap was about 15” to bring my hits up to center .
I tried the shot split finger and to my surprise I dropped the next arrow near the center without gapping . Next arrow , same results .
Most traditional rules says index finger must touch the nock , it doesn’t say over or under the nock .
Anybody switch shooting styles depending on distance?
Do you setup your bow for three under , or split finger ? Or do you try to tune somewhere between .
Most shots at Traditional shoots are usually 25 yards or less . So , I’m more accurate out to about 22-23 yards , shooting three under .
So , I’m probably be better off setting up for three under and just use split for any long shots .

Last edited by gillchaser; 06-28-2020 at 04:12 PM.
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  #2  
Old 06-28-2020, 04:25 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

I have done that for years. When I started competing I was shooting FITA target with a barebow. I had to shoot 90, 70, 50 and 30 meters.

For 90 I used either my arrow tip or shelf to aim (depending on the bow I was using) and shot split finger.
For 70 I could shoot either split finger with arrow tip, or three under using the shelf to aim.
For 50 and 30 and changed to three under.

I had a 20 meter difference between three under and split, a 10 meter difference between the arrow tip and my rest wire, and a 20 meter difference between my arrow tip and the shelf.

That is why I could shoot 70 meters either way, the 20 meters changes cancelled out.

For field archery, I string walk out to about 30 yards and then switch to pick-a-point (straight three under) using my high anchor. At about 45 yards I start aiming with my shelf. This is all with my high anchor.

Beyond about 58 yards I have to drop my anchor and eventually go to split finger.

So I am doing a combination of stringwalking, facewalking and pick-a-point. It is all necessary to cover such a large range of distances without a sight, and actually have something to aim with.

I definitely setup my bow for the format. My field bow does not have the horsepower for FITA target. Even 70 meters is a stretch for that bow. It is setup for WA field where the longest shot is 50 meters. It does a real good job over that range.

I does not do so well for the longer NFAA shots. My target bow does best at 70 meters and not so well at 30 meters. I often change bows and arrow as distances change for FITA target since it is legal to do so.

I was really having trouble at 30 near the end of my time shooting target. I setup a 30 meter bow and almost broke my personal best. The only thing that stopped me was fatigue since I was shooting one day FITA's at the time. Most are two days. I shot two with that bow and ran out of gas in the last two ends each time. 30 is the last distance we shoot.
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  #3  
Old 06-28-2020, 04:44 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

I shot 3-under and string-walked up to my point-on of 32 yds. That way I could cover most of the 25yd and under targets, and I could move to split-finger to get a 43 yd point-on. Not an uncommon method.

My backyard had targets up to 40 yd, the local 3D shoots had targets up to 44yd, thus the need for the 43yd point-on. But for hunting I used a 'fixed crawl' of 25yd.
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  #4  
Old 06-28-2020, 05:16 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

You don't really need to set your point-on to your maximum distance. That makes the shorter shots more difficult. You can aim with your rest wire or shelf. Actually, I find the shelf to be a very stable pointing device for long shots. You avoid the double penalty if you creep. The double penalty is when your arrow creeps forward causing you to lose power. It also causes you to aim lower which will make your arrow fall short. I do much better using the shelf. You have to get used to it. Mostly, getting alignment right, but when you do, there is a huge benefit. The rest wire works well also if you have a rest. Some folks use front and back of shelf as different aiming points, but I can't see that when I am shooting.
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Old 06-28-2020, 05:33 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

When shooting competition depending upon the equipment class you register in, doing what you propose would not be legal for like say Traditional Recurve or Longbow class. Yes index finger must touch, and ONE finger position or anchor position for whole event. But if you in something like a Barebow class would most likely be legal. Think Stringwalking.
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  #6  
Old 06-28-2020, 08:12 PM
Grantmac Grantmac is offline
 
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

If you are 20yds point on 3 under then either your anchor is too high or your arrows are too slow.
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  #7  
Old 06-28-2020, 08:37 PM
gillchaser gillchaser is online now
 
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grantmac View Post
If you are 20yds point on 3 under then either your anchor is too high or your arrows are too slow.
Full length 1816’s out of a 30# bow . Anchor is index finger in the corner of my mouth . Actually it’s behind the corner of the mouth at the edge of my cheek .
I try to shoot instinctively but do line up using the arrow shaft . I’ve yet to figure out how you guys are using the point of the arrow to aim with . I shoot like I would be shooting a slingshot .
So , I have no idea what my “point on “ is . My maximum effective range is around 23-24 yards . That’s where my arrows drop off and I have to pick a spot above where I want to hit and lob the arrow in .
It’s a system I’ve taught myself that works .
I’ve just started shooting three under because it’s easier on my fingers .

So, I guess my arrows are too slow for most folks . But for me , as long as they make it to the target and stick in , I’m ok .
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Old 06-28-2020, 08:40 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

Yes, you can use different methods for different distances and it can be a very accurate way to shoot. So accurate that it is why it is not allowed in many competition classes.

The reason is that most archers prefer to use standard methods, and do not want to have to change methods to be competitive. So they have relegated the non-standard methods to separate classes.

It is entirely possible to learn how to shoot all the distances with standard methods, it is just a bit harder to learn how. Both Rednef and I have won the National Marked 3D Championship at from 7 to 101 yards, in the longbow classification (wooden arrows.)

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  #9  
Old 06-28-2020, 09:40 PM
Grantmac Grantmac is offline
 
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

Most guys are getting a point on around 45-50yds 3 under with a similar anchor, so faster arrows is the call.
A light 800 carbon will work much better. I shot a lot of WA Field and outdoor Target with 30# limbs and 800s.
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  #10  
Old 06-28-2020, 09:57 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

Since the OP is talking about tiller I think he is not focused on the longbow class. Longbow takes away a lot of options to deal with different distances. More estimating is involved. Also, sometimes the rules are not fully understood. I have shot in the longbow division a few times. On one occasion a really good longbow shooter started to explain how he dropped his anchor when taking the long shots. Neither him, or the other really good shooter in our group knew that this was not legal until I told them. But that is how both were dealing with the longer shots. It was completely inadvertent. A single unchanging hook and anchor is mandated for all shots. You can still learn the shots, but it is less analytical and more just shooting them time and again until you can reproduce the positions. Non restrictive recurve classes allow many options to cobble together an aiming system, and you can take advantage of all or some. As such, longbow and less restrictive classes are two separate discussions.
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  #11  
Old 06-29-2020, 06:45 AM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

Gillchaser, as you can see above, a good competitive barebow recurve archer will use every trick in the book to make the shot - string walk, face walk, gap, use riser landmarks, and change hook. My experience is similar to Hank - point-on three-under at 50m, switch to split-finger for 70m and 90m, string walk under 50m, and aim off the shelf for >50m to <70m string walking and to split-finger for 90m.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:29 AM
KirkMcquest KirkMcquest is offline
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

I dont see how its any different from any other type of stringwalking. It IS stringwalking. You're "walking" up the string to the split finger position increasing your gap and giving you a longer shot.

What I'd like to see is "quiver walking", where you might choose a different weight/length/spine/FOC arrow for different distances. Ive been shooting with two sets of arrows in my quiver. With a lighter arrow Im point on at 35 yds, with a heavier arrow Im point on at 25yds. Nothing needs to change in my position, draw, anchor point or anything. Its just the arrow that changes, I have different colored nocks so I can quickly grab the arrow I need.

I dont think this is allowed in most competitions which makes no sense to me, if you can string walk, face walk and etc...why not "arrow walk"?
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:30 AM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

On my field archery barebow, I shoot 3 under up to 50 yards with a 40 yard point on. After 50 I shoot split finger. It is not uncommon for people to do this. I use different things as aiming points, top of target, bottom of target, plunger, front of shelf, back of shelf.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:44 AM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

Quote:
Originally Posted by KirkMcquest View Post
I dont see how its any different from any other type of stringwalking. It IS stringwalking. You're "walking" up the string to the split finger position increasing your gap and giving you a longer shot.

What I'd like to see is "quiver walking", where you might choose a different weight/length/spine/FOC arrow for different distances. Ive been shooting with two sets of arrows in my quiver. With a lighter arrow Im point on at 35 yds, with a heavier arrow Im point on at 25yds. Nothing needs to change in my position, draw, anchor point or anything. Its just the arrow that changes, I have different colored nocks so I can quickly grab the arrow I need.

I dont think this is allowed in most competitions which makes no sense to me, if you can string walk, face walk and etc...why not "arrow walk"?
While I don't advocate that for field, I did exactly that when shooting FITA target where it is legal to change arrows, as long as you shoot the same arrows for each distance. I would shoot ACE for 90 meters and then go to ACG for 70 meters and in. I did not cut arrows to get a better sight point, though I know a guy who does. On one occasion I even used heavier aluminum arrows for 30 meters. I shot 30 full FITA's and tried a lot of stuff. I once went through bow inspection with three bows: one for 90 and 70, one for 50 and one for 30 meters. Different arrows can be done for field but that means changing arrows from target to target. I like the challenge of trying to figure out how to shoot the shots with one set of arrows. That, of course, is my personal preference.
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  #15  
Old 06-29-2020, 01:44 PM
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Default Re: Changing shooting styles for longer shots

I am not to date on these current target archery variations. I did know about the indoor PAA from back in the 60s and early 70s, and I shot the outdoor field rounds with sights, loved the 70 and 90 targets. Question: Just how big are the bullseyes and at what yardages are we talking about with the string crawler's rounds and how tight are folks grouping? I had a guy that had never shot a recurve before grouping as tight as I was, softballs out to 24 yards with in an hour of taking his first shot with a recurve bow. He was shooting split finger.
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