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Dang Black Widow

22K views 48 replies 21 participants last post by  Southern Fried 
#1 ·
Received my yearly catalog a few days ago. I generally just put them up without
Looking at them as I had quit archery for a bout 6years.

I started back a year ago this past November going the ILF route and never looked at their 2016 catalog.

The ILF thing has been good but ever tome I shoot my ILF bows those Black widow days are always nagging at me. It is like having a little man standing on each shoulder one saying the ILF thing is good and the other saying Black Widow over and over.

Well I think the little Black Widow guy is winning.

Just sent an email to the guys with some specs for pricing.

I've had two PSA Vs one was stolen, Bocote PLX and PLX V and the PSR V but my favorite was the Greybark PSA with bamboo limbs.

So I'm looking at a Greybark 60" PMA with the bamboo limbs no red in the riser or white on the limbs.

Hate to say it but most likely my ILF rigs will go up for sale. I'm the type of guy that only needs one main bow and a beater to throw in the bottom of the boat or back of a side by side.

Walker
 
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#2 ·
I barely peeked in mine. Cut the mailing label off it and left it with the other archery mags when I got my oil changed yesterday :)
 
#3 ·
i have always wanted a widow, just like the design of the reverse riser.
Purchased a pl longbow loved the lines of the deflex reflex unstrung.
My love of their longbow ended there, expensive wall hanger.
I ordered a 64" PMA X and The difference between longbow/recurve was night and day. Really enjoy the PMA just wish they would make longer limbs.

Thinking of a black and white ebony PMA riser and greybark limbs.
Still thinking on it tho

Chad
 
#5 ·
i have always wanted a widow, just like the design of the reverse riser.
Purchased a pl longbow loved the lines of the deflex reflex unstrung.
My love of their longbow ended there, expensive wall hanger.
I ordered a 64" PMA X and The difference between longbow/recurve was night and day. Really enjoy the PMA just wish they would make longer limbs.

Thinking of a black and white ebony PMA riser and greybark limbs.
Still thinking on it tho

Chad
Say Chad what is it you don't like about the PL?

Mine were good shooters but I did better work with the PSAs.
 
#6 · (Edited)
Crazy timing for this thread...I understand the desire for simplicity as well. I have always wanted a PA in 62", yes..a one piece. The lines are great and it has decent mass weight for a one piece. The PMA we had for years never let us down, a great bow. I have a friend currently eyeballing these and I think he's gonna order one. I'm secretly jealous since I've been shooting a lot of RU rigs and that inner voice says.. "Only thing you have to adjust is the brace height" and just shoot it. I think they would make a fantastic Traditional Hunter class rig as well. I have simple tastes and favor the PA II in Greybark. Nothing fancy but not ordinary either.
 
#8 ·
Ok this thread is a sign from God that I should drop the hammer. I have not liked BW for years mainly because of some interactions with a few BW shooters nothing to do with the bow. I have broken through this and I am closely moving toward a Green leaf PA.. Seems like a very stable platform.
 
#9 ·
I have pretty much settled on PL's ... I always keep my Titan but everything else is being sold .
They are the bow I thought about for years but never pulled the trigger...when I did , it turned up , I put probably 100 arrows through it and ordered another one .
It doesn't do any one particular thing that stands out, but does everything so well as a whole that it covers a bunch of bases for me.
I get tempted by a PCH as a hunting bow but doubt I'd like it as much as my Titan and at heart I am a longbow kinda fella .

At best I may order another Pl .. this time an X as I love either Osage or Yew ... and my current line up is a Greybark t/d and an Autumn Oak 1pce. ( and I love the Greybark)

Great service and reliability when ordering (important when a one piece will cost $300 in shipping!) and the boys at Widow are as good as anyone in the business IMHO

Bit of a fan boy here ....
 
#12 ·
I will forever like the riser on the MA series, although when I bought mine in '91, I almost bought the black magnesium risered bow. I just like the look of the Greybark the most.

I don't shoot my 60# MAII any more but I cannot get rid of it. I also liked the look of the PSR, I just don't see a lot said about them.
 
#13 ·
NOW ya gone & done it.
How do I get me one o' them there DANG WIDOW catalogs?
I had one old 1200 a few months, and a friend of mine has it now.
I might be interested in buying a BW.
 
#14 · (Edited)
When I decided I wanted to try one, I just bought the longest heaviest mass weight they make. A 64" PMA II. I had no experience with them and nobody in my circles years ago had one to try, I'm glad I did. They are indeed built to take some lumps and last. What I found incredible after I'd been shooting 70" longbows and 70" RU rigs, I demoed a 58" from a local shop. A PSAX in some pretty wood. I completely expected stack and all kinds of other maladies from this short bow. I was shocked when it was stack free to my 29.50" draw. It was also stable shooting.

It's one of most popular trad bows for a reason, the DFC's from Blacky on the various models backs up the no stack I encountered. As you can imagine, the 64" was no where near it's stack point at my draw. In fact, some of the models go past 31" before stack starts. The other thing is, their performance tested at an 8 3/8" brace height (fps) on AMO standards (26.75" from the back of the grip plus 1.75") by Blacky shows that this design is in fact dead even nearly (1fps difference) with the performance of a current set of Win & Win RCX 100 carbon foam and glassless medium limbs on a 25" riser. Blacky uses 9 gpp on everything so the test is fair.

They have a distinct feel as well as sound, everyone that owns one knows this sound...the low frequency "thud". Tuning them is so easy it can be done in your sleep lol. A friend asked me if I could choose one for for Traditional Hunter class and to hunt with and only have one bow? I chose the PA..he was shocked with my answer. Traditonal Hunter class in IBO requires a wood..and or NON metal bow to compete with. Based on my experience with the PMA, I know they make quality stuff.

Heres an old video shooting the PMA in the heat from 2012



Here is the thing everyone, and I hope this tidbit might help someone. I shot that bow extremely well, but then I got caught in the better shooting through aggressive spending habit. I jumped off the BW train and ran headlong into full on RU rigs. I've had many 70" target rigs and longbows. See I thought I had to have the RU rigs and 70" olympic recurves to be competitive. So I was all in...many of you know that, and some of the tournaments rigs I've shown here or elsewhere. After several years of competing and shooting mostly high dollar olympic stuff a realization hit me when talking to a friend on the phone the other day. You see I was trying to buy points, and I tried a lot of stuff! It just doesn't work they way people. Honestly my 3D scores, from the tournaments and locals were no better than what I had a accomplished with my PMA. If you don't want to take my word for it, check the scores in RU - (A class that allows just about every perceived advantage you can think of) to those of the recurve class. They shoot from the same stake and max distance.

There is no huge or even marginal score difference between the two classes. I'll share another lesson, always shoot where your heart is, you will ALWAYS want to shoot that bow, no matter what it is, Longbow recurve, ru rig, whatever...but I will tell you with a straight face I regret not having this simple PMA anymore. I've shot the same course with my RU rig, and that widow..there was a less than 6 point score spread. You don't need to have a 70" barebow rig to be competitive, and anybody that tells you different is blowing smoke. Take my word for it, I have no reason to misrepresent any of this. Having that ru rig might just be a confidence builder which is a good thing in itself, but you'd be surprised what you can do with a simple wood bow.
 
#16 ·
Love my pch. Though short at 58" for my 29.5" draw (bought it pre rod jenkins seminar-dang draw length changed by almost 1.5" lol) it is smooth and quiet and forgiving. And very nice looking too.

Also would highly recommend trying the low grip if you haven't before. Very comfortable! I've had the standard and asbell grips and they didn't quite do it for me.
 
#24 ·
Never a stacing problem.

Each of their bows have a recommended limb length at your draw length.

Example for their PSA

23" to 27" 56"limbs
25" to 29" 58"
27" to 31" 60"
29" to 33" 62"

At the time shooting heavier poundage i had a 28" dl so i choose 58" bow.
After it was stolen i ordered a 60" and did not get the same performance.

With the much lighter draw weights i shoot now my dl is 29.5" so i would choose the 60" limbs for the PSA or PMA.

Walker
 
#29 ·
They have the 60th anniversary PSAx now but I prefer the pchx for the shorter window and bow. Thing is, even at a 28.5 ish DL, the 58" widow doesn't stack at all. I shot is side by side for a while with a 60" blacktail Sitka. It was a pretty bow but felt heavier than the widow even though it was 2lbs lighter. Sold the Sitka.
 
#33 ·
Yeah, got my catalog too.
Tempting.
Had an MA built in 87, and two SAs , one built in 01 and 04.
Had an HS a target HF1225 and now a hunter HF1225

Was thinking how much OT I'd have to work to budget one.........but the kid's jaw popped out so surgery tomorrow, and it's a widow out of pocket after insurance (3rd time in about a month). Oh well, maybe after I max out of pocket...........next month
 
#34 ·
Back when I was shooting 3D with my 1st SA2.............using hunting weight arrows................no my bow wasn't the fastest. Was not the slowest either.
Sure as heck wasn't as noisy as most.

Won some smaller shoots, never embarrassed myself. Killed deer dead.

Widow is good enough for me.

Problem is, don't shoot much anymore...........can't justify the expense.
Proly don't shoot enough to justify the old HF1225 I have.

But as a kid I always wanted a "skeleton" widow, and I have a nice one.
So am pretty content.

Wouldn't mind a PCH, 44# @28" and 56" limbs.........grey bark (like all the others I had built). But IMHO the SA series has the more balanced riser. Both of mine were 58" and sweethearts.

55 and 57# they were.

My HS was 60# and it was a bit much when the back started giving me fits.
LOVED the way that riser felt.

Last run of those, 58" and FF rated, radiused riser..........at 45-50# would be awesome. But the new stuff has more preload..........so a new production rig will proly smoke it speed wise.
 
#35 ·
I've got the bug too. I had a SA III made in '92 and it was the best shooting bow I've ever owned. Not the fastest but so consistent and just "pointed" so well. Just hit where I was looking. At 51# at my draw it would be heavier than I want to shoot today. I have a couple of the skelatal bows and one of the solid metal risers and I love those old bows though the solid bow needs new limbs.
What are the differences in today's BW as compared to the SA from the 90's. I no longer hunt but I love 3D shoots. I love my ILF bows for their attributes but would probably get rid of all of them for another BW that shot like my old one. (Of course, it couldn't be me that's changed in 25 years. :) )
 
#36 ·
I bought a Widow longbow in July of 2015. on Nov. the 8TH I had a 4 wheeler flip with me it delaminated my bow in the 4 flips. I posted on the Widow wall what had happened for everybody to be careful. 2 days latter Black Widow calls me and ask how I am doing. I said okay was really lucky to be alive. Toby said looks like your bow is done. I said yeah it is he said I have your order up where you bought it. he said we are going to make you a new one. I said how much will it cost me and he said nothing just send the broke one back. just thought I would share the story.
 
#42 ·
I went to the Trad Expo In Kalamzoo,MI. and spent my time with the Black Widow boys. Shot a lot of the PSA and PMA. A long with getting the right limb length you need to get the right grip. For me it was the low grip. I ordered a PMAII In gray bark without white 37# +/- 2# at 28. I tried the PSA in 62" limbs and it wasn't quiet or smooth. When I tried the PMA in 62" it was Smooth and the arrows were going where I was looking. Now the wait!
 
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